How AI safety took a backseat to military money

Today, we’re talking about the future of Xbox. Phil Spencer, a two-time Decoder guest who’s led Xbox for more than a decade, is stepping down. But in a shocking twist, his deputy long-assumed successor Sarah Bond is also out too, and the Xbox division is now in the hands of an Asha Sharma, one of Microsoft’s AI executives with no prior game industry experience. There is no better person to talk to about all of this than Tom Warren, senior editor here at The Verge and author of the excellent Notepad newsletter. Tom is actually on parental leave right now, but Microsoft has a longstanding habit of disrupting his well-earned time off. So, Tom was gracious enough to come on the show after publishing a major scoop about what went down at Xbox this past week. Read the full interview transcript on The Verge. Links: Inside Microsoft’s big Xbox leadership shake-up | The Verge Billions of dollars later and still nobody knows what an Xbox is | The Verge Xbox chief Phil Spencer is leaving Microsoft | The Verge Read Xbox chief Phil Spencer’s memo about leaving Microsoft | The Verge Here’s what Xbox is working on for 2026 | The Verge AMD hints Microsoft could launch its next-gen Xbox in 2027 | The Verge The next Xbox is going to be very different | The Verge Xbox co-founder believes it’s being ‘sunsetted’ in favor of AI | VGC Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder! Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Decoder is produced by Kate Cox and Nick Statt and edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today, I’m talking with Hank Green, a longtime friend of Decoder and the co-founder and now former owner of Complexly, an online education company he started with his brother John in 2012. I say former owner because Hank and John have just converted Complexly into a nonprofit and given up their ownership of the company in the process. That’s some of the purest Decoder bait that ever was, because it’s all about how you structure a company and how you make decisions about changing that structure. So of course I had to bring Hank back on to talk all about it. Read the full interview transcript on The Verge. Links:  Greens’ studio becomes nonprofit as they aim to make ‘trustworthy content’ | AP Hank Green makes Nilay Patel explain why websites have a future | Decoder (2024) Why Hank Green can’t quit YouTube for TikTok | Decoder (2022) Hank Green and Sam Reich on running content companies | Decoder Hank Green and Sal Khan on AI in educational video | Decoder Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder! Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Decoder is produced by Kate Cox and Nick Statt and edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.  The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today we're talking about the war for AI talent. Right now, the hottest job market on the planet is for AI researchers. And the vast majority of these people are concentrated into a small number of hugely valuable, extremely fast-growing companies in the San Francisco Bay Area, most of which are now paying some of the highest salaries in the history of tech to poach from one another. We’ve been dying to really dig in and try to unpack what's going on with all these talent moves in AI. So we brought on Verge senior AI reporter Hayden Field, who's been covering the revolving door of the AI industry really closely and also the broader culture that's motivating workers to jump ship.  Links: What’s behind the mass exodus at xAI? | The Verge OpenClaw founder Peter Steinberger is joining OpenAI | The Verge Two more xAI co-founders leave after the SpaceX merger | The Verge AI safety leader says 'world is in peril' and quits to study poetry | BBC OpenAI is making the mistakes Facebook made. I quit. | NYT Anthropic’s chief on AI: ‘We don’t know if the models are conscious’ | NYT Meet the one woman Anthropic trusts to teach AI morals | WSJ OpenAI plans fourth-quarter IPO in race to beat Anthropic to market | WSJ Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder! Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Decoder is produced by Kate Cox and Nick Statt and edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.  The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today, we're talking about the camera company Ring, lost dogs, and the surveillance state. Since it aired for a massive audience at the Super Bowl, Ring’s Search Party commercial has become a lightning rod for controversy. It’s easy to see how the same technology that can find lost dogs can be used to find people, and then used to invade our privacy in all kinds of uncomfortable ways, by cops and regular people alike. Although Ring has since canceled its partnership with controversial surveillance company Flock, the company is now facing hard questions about its plans to use AI to promote safer neighborhoods, and how that intersects with its ongoing relationship with law enforcement.  Links:  Ring cancels partnership with Flock after surveillance backlash | The Verge Ring’s lost dog ad sparks backlash amid fears of surveillance | The Verge Ring says it’s not giving ICE access to its cameras | The Verge How police recovered Nancy Guthrie’s Nest Doorbell footage | The Verge Ring’s Jamie Siminoff thinks AI can reduce crime | Decoder Ring CEO says cameras can almost ‘zero out crime’ within 12 months | The Verge ICE taps into nationwide AI camera network, data shows | 404 Media ICE, Secret Service had access to Flock's camera network | 404 Media Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder! Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Decoder is produced by Kate Cox and Nick Statt and edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.  The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

My guest today is Bridget McCormack, former chief justice for the Michigan Supreme Court and now president and CEO of the American Arbitration Association. For the past several years, Bridget and her team have been developing an AI-assisted arbitration platform called the AI Arbitrator. So I sat down with her to talk about how the tool works, the pros and cons of automating parts of the arbitration process, and the bigger picture questions around institutional trust, justice, and the future of law.  Links:  All rise for JudgeGPT | The Verge Why do lawyers keep using ChatGPT? | The Verge Judge berates AI entrepreneur for using a generated ‘lawyer’ | The Verge Judge slams lawyers for ‘bogus AI-generated research’ | The Verge LexisNexis CEO says the AI law era is already here | Decoder ChatGPT can be a disaster for lawyers — Robin AI wants to fix that | Decoder Considerations In building guardrails for AI use In arbitration | Law360 The AI Arbitrator: What it is, what it isn’t, and where it’s going | Law360 Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder! Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Decoder is produced by Kate Cox and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Chris Jereza and Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.  The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices